Comments on: Can packaged applications ever be Lean? #BTF09

By: Scott Francis

Scott Francis — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 23:50:04 +0000

@Connie – to take it a step further, even Lean itself isn’t the primary goal, but the means to the end of ROI, speed, reduced overhead, etc (your last point). ie, it isn’t an end state but a process of improvement method/mindset/culture.

Also, I know what you mean by the “mass production” process – something that is split into bite size chunks of work – but let’s not forget that toyota mass produces autos and they are essentially the holy grail for Lean advocates – so it isn’t the “mass” nature of what the process is that makes it not-lean. I’ve been to toyota factory floors, they have assembly lines, they’re just “leaner” than the traditional assembly line, and organized using different principles than the classic henry ford assembly line. They also employ related techniques that aren’t specifically “Lean” techniques, like 5s, kaizen (sp?) events, six sigma, etc.

By: Connie Moore

Connie Moore — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 22:00:39 +0000

I think this debate is interesting, but focuses on only one dimension of the Lean discussion, namely, Lean SW. I tend to agree with your first commenter who says that some of this totally misses the point. To me, what matters most in the Leanness debate is whether or not the application software embodies a lean process or a mass production process. If the packaged app automates a well thought through Lean process, then it matters less to me that the app isn’t SaaS, doesn’t use Open Source, etc. Similarly, if the packaged app automates an old industrial age mass production process, then I really don’t want to give it points for being in the cloud, because the process is what ultimately matters. The trump card in the leanness debate is the leanness or non-leanness of the process that is embodied in the app; that is what really saves money or costs money or delights customers in the long run.

By: 'Lean IT': another buzzphrase for something we've been trying to do all along? | Service-Oriented Architecture | ZDNet.com

Mon, 12 Oct 2009 10:10:06 +0000

[...] As reported in my last post, Sandy Kemsley has done a great job of covering Forrester’s Business Technology Forum, which focused on Lean IT. [...]

By: Scott Francis

Scott Francis — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 07:07:42 +0000

I think this debate completely misses the point. Who cares if a packaged app vs. custom development is Lean? What you care about is ROI, TCO, value to the business, time to market, does it solve your business problem…

And as you point out, let’s just say packaged apps aren’t lean. What, are you going to write your own spreadsheet? process modeler? email server? Give me a break

Now, of course, you can argue about specific apps – SAP or Oracle’s applications suites- and then the argument has more merit because the “non-lean-ness” of these apps actually hurts you in some respects. But arguing over whether they’re lean or not just misses the fundamental business drivers entirely. Lean is the principled approach to apply to your projects, it isn’t a good way to characterize end-product… or at least, characterizing it as such doesn’t help me make good business decisions…

By: Question: can packaged apps join the 'Lean IT' bandwagon? | Service-Oriented Architecture | ZDNet.com

Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:31 +0000

[...] Forrester Business Technology Forum in Chicago, and picked up on an interesting panel discussion on the role of packaged applications in Lean IT. (Lean IT is the theme of Forrester’s [...]